Taff Vale Coal Traffic

[stephebm]

A large subject.

a) In early days did the TVR pickup from more than one colliery on a train or did it run block trains from one colliery
b) Were single wagons from smaller agents from UK in general worked in with the main traffic to the docks etc, or were they picked up by freight, as opposed to mineral, trains?
c) With the extensive storage sidings was the traffic worked sequentially down the line to the docks, or were the sidings effectively "allocated" to individual collieries and worked to the docks directly? (In other words, is coal moved from colliery to a set of storage sidings and then direct to the docks.
d) Presumably the various shunting engines in storage sidings were shuffling PO wagons about?
e) How were return traffic eg empties, pit props etc etc worked - see a)b)c)d) in reverse!

Regards

Basil

[Rhobat Bryn]

With regard to point c, the only information I have is that the Barry Railway used to take trains down to Cadoxton Sidings and then take them on to Barry Docks sidings. From there, they were taken on to the loading docks. We know this because the B1s used to haul the coal trains from Hafod Sidings to Cadoxton Sidings. Then they were taken to Barry Docks by the class H 0-8-2s, often being taken 100 at a time. Then the F class would shunt them from the Dock Sidings to the various loading points.

[stephebm]

Just to clarify my question at point c);

Having left a colliery would one or more wagons be moved into each in turn of the sequential storage etc sets of sidings OR would it/they go to one set and from there direct to the docks. My personal GUESS is both depending on the conditions at the time.

[0083]

Until the early 1960s Block Trains for coal traffic were unheard of and in answer to your specific queries;
B) Either method was used
C) Sidings were allocated for loaded wagons by type of coal particularly for shipment which was usually blended and for the empties by colliery owner. Shipment traffic was always a problem since wagons were held pending berthing of ships and then an urgency for loading in order to minimise wharfage. POW Coal wagons came under NCB ownership in 1947 and then BR on its creation in 1948. As a result large chunks of wagon shunting was eliminated
D) Yes
As a matter of interest, The Home signal for Cadoxton North Box had a route indicator which identified Siding for the loaded wagons and Siding down which Brake van was to be gravitated. The South Box Home Signal had a similar indicator to advise Traincrew which siding contained the empties for the return working and obviously the siding for the engine to return to the North End.

[Menelaus]

As for (b) I'm don't claim any knowledge or expertise in these matters but I'd be surprised if "single wagons from smaller agents" were destined for export from the docks. I can't see the economics working. Wouldn't such single load traffic be for domestic (i.e UK) consumption and short local trips?

[s.w.johnson]

Why not have a look at some photographs?? There must be some around.