LNWR trains over the Rhymney Railway

[Penrhos1920]

I posted this yesterday on Rmweb when I should have done it here.

As I understand it the LNWR had running powers over the Rhymney Railway and they had their own goods depot in Cardiff docks. Where the running powers limited to only through goods trains? Were they allowed to drop off or pick up wagons on the way? What motive power was used post WW1?

[Newport_rod]

What motive power was used post WW1?

This extract from Kidner may help shed some light:

The LMS continued to run the former LNW's coal trains down to Cardiff Docks; oddly enough, the LNWR had just assigned its new Beames 0-8-4T engines to this duty, but they became so notorious for bursting points and straightening curves that the GWR promptly banned them and the old 0-8-0 engines returned.

[Newport_rod]

And the loco involved in the 1925 Tirphil landslip was ex-LNWR 607, LMS 7647, a coal tank, which was shedded at Abergavenny in 1920 so may well have been working to Cardiff in LNWR days.

[Tim Birch]

The LNWR working timetable for April 1908 onwards contains some details. Broadly, the goods workings were through ones, with very limited intermediate work. Traffic for the Barry was detached at Energlyn Jct and for the Alexandra Dock line at Caerphilly. When I can work out how to attach an image, I can post the relevant page from the wtt.

[Newport_rod]

Thank you Tim, does the ADR traffic include both Newport- and Pontypridd-bound?
Regards
Rod

[Tim Birch]

Rod,
If I could attach the page from the wtt I would do so. As well as the times of trains the page has an explanatory paragraph which in terms of the ADR merely says:
'All trains from Abergavenny Junction to Cardiff to run through from Rhymney to Cardiff and must not convey wagons for any intermediate stations except those for the Barry and Alex Dock Co's lines which will be detached at Energlyn Junction and Caerphilly...The L&NW trains from Cardiff will call at Energlyn Junction for traffic from the Barry line, and at Caerphilly for traffic from the Alex dock Co's line, but must not call at other Rhymney line stations except for urgent goods and foreign empties. All other traffic for L&NW line to be forwarded by the RR Co's local trains to Rhymney and be picked up there by L&NW trains.

I hope this helps.

[Daifly]

Tim
If you can save the page as a .jpg you can attach it. Sadly and bizarrely, the most common form of document that we need to post - .pdf - is not permitted!
Dave

[Newport_rod]

Tim, that sheds more light and thank you for the extended posting.

The reference to foreign empties caught my eye. I suppose, in those days before common user arrangements, it might mean that a LNWR train could pick up (say) a L&Y empty from Bargoed (but not the LNWR wagon that might be in the same siding).

[Tim Birch]

LNWR &RR WTT small (1).jpg

This is the page from the wtt.

[Tim Birch]

Yes I think so. Rhymney seems to have worked as a boundary, with the joint tracks ending at the northern end of the platforms. Presumably it was one of the complex working agreements worked out between the two companies and would be influenced by miles worked per company, income derived from different traffic, engine costs and others. It would be interesting to know how much traffic was generated for the LNWR by the intermediate stations on the line. My impression is that the route to Cardiff was viewed as a long distance through route and it was better for the LNWR to use Rhymney as a concentration point for local traffic.