queries on old photos

Locomotives, coaches, and wagons

queries on old photos

Postby andrewnummelin » Thu Nov 07, 2019 7:17 pm

I've just been going through a few things that have come to the Circle as part of the late Gerald Davies collection, and I've found a few things that really caught my eye for different reasons.

In an early photo of Pontypool:
GD-Pontypool-front399px.jpg
GD-Pontypool-front399px.jpg (88.15 KiB) Viewed 455 times

1. Why is there a loco at what appears to be the rear of the train?
2. Has anyone information on the John J. Murphy wagon? I've not come across this company before.

In a post card of Ebbw Vale (undated, produced in Ebbw Vale):
GD-EbbwVale-front399px.jpg
GD-EbbwVale-front399px.jpg (114.03 KiB) Viewed 455 times

Can anyone offer information about the coaches?

In an image, probably from Cyfarthfa Castle and taken by Robert Thompson Crawshay in the 1870s:
1399vvv399px.jpg
1399vvv399px.jpg (72.17 KiB) Viewed 455 times

Can anyone identify any of the stock? It's not common to see a goods break van between loco and passenger coaches. (The viaduct has 7 arches.)


Sorry the detail is not as good as I would wish as the forum only allows images up to 400 pixels wide.
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Re: queries on old photos

Postby Noel » Sat Nov 09, 2019 8:44 pm

andrewnummelin wrote:Sorry the detail is not as good as I would wish as the forum only allows images up to 400 pixels wide.


Are you sure, Andrew? I seem to remember bigger photos than that have been posted previously. As it is the posted versions are a bit too small to be useful, at least for the long distance shots.
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Re: queries on old photos

Postby andrewnummelin » Sun Nov 10, 2019 11:52 am

Noel wrote:
andrewnummelin wrote:Sorry the detail is not as good as I would wish as the forum only allows images up to 400 pixels wide.


Are you sure, Andrew? I seem to remember bigger photos than that have been posted previously. As it is the posted versions are a bit too small to be useful, at least for the long distance shots.


This is the error message I received:

The image must be at least 0 pixels wide, 0 pixels high and at most 400 pixels wide and 400 pixels high. The submitted image is 5415 pixels wide and 1660 pixels high.

There's also a 2MB limit on file size.

Rob plans to put them in the next Newsletter: they should be clearer there.
Last edited by andrewnummelin on Sun Nov 10, 2019 8:00 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: queries on old photos

Postby Noel » Sun Nov 10, 2019 2:15 pm

There are two examples here http://wrrc.org.uk/phpbb/viewtopic.php?f=15&t=1016 of larger images. Both are well within the 2Mb limit [which is, incidentally, much larger than a 400 x 400 pixel image is going to be], but the map is 1600 x 636 pixels and the photograph is 1140 x 646. Assuming that the forum's limits have not been changed recently, the logical conclusion would seem to be that the error message is not from the forum or only relates to one particular method of inserting images. Perhaps the webmaster could shed some light on this?
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Re: queries on old photos

Postby Wagonworks_andy » Fri Nov 15, 2019 5:02 pm

I have increased the image size to 1000 x 1000.
Hope that helps.
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Re: queries on old photos

Postby andrewnummelin » Mon Nov 18, 2019 10:28 am

Wagonworks_andy wrote:I have increased the image size to 1000 x 1000.
Hope that helps.
Andy

Thanks Andy, here are 1000pixel wide versions.
GD-Pontypool-1000px.jpg
GD-Pontypool-1000px.jpg (274.38 KiB) Viewed 377 times

GD-EbbwVale-1000px.jpg
GD-EbbwVale-1000px.jpg (439.46 KiB) Viewed 377 times

1399vvv-1000px.jpg
1399vvv-1000px.jpg (209.18 KiB) Viewed 377 times
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Re: queries on old photos

Postby Noel » Mon Nov 18, 2019 12:26 pm

A wander around the internet has found https://www.genuki.org.uk/big/wal/GLA/Cardiff/slaters.1880 which lists "Murphy John J. & Co., 2 Dock chambers" under iron Ore Importers. They are also listed in [url]specialcollections.le.ac.uk › digital › api › collection › download[/url], which links to a downloadable .pdf file, so I haven't looked at it. Hopefully this is the right company...

So far as the train is concerned, I have no idea where exactly it is, and which way it's going, so can only speculate. However, there is a brake van between the loco and the train, so possibly a banking engine?

So far as the train on the viaduct is concerned, more speculation is all I can offer. The date, if correct, is before the compulsory use of continuous brakes, so that the train may lack these. There may be a guard's compartment in the rear coach, I can't really tell, but none of the others seem to have one, so has the operator borrowed a goods brake in order to have a handbrake at each end, possibly? Or even a handbrake at all, if I'm wrong about the rear coach?
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Re: queries on old photos

Postby Newport_rod » Mon Nov 18, 2019 3:51 pm

The viaduct view looks like Pontsarn to me (see https://www.google.co.uk/url?sa=i&rct=j ... 8245272251) . And the GBV rather like the one in this view taken at Pontsticill,
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Re: queries on old photos

Postby andrewnummelin » Wed Nov 20, 2019 6:13 pm

Noel wrote:A wander around the internet has found https://www.genuki.org.uk/big/wal/GLA/Cardiff/slaters.1880 which lists "Murphy John J. & Co., 2 Dock chambers" under iron Ore Importers. They are also listed in [url]specialcollections.le.ac.uk › digital › api › collection › download[/url], which links to a downloadable .pdf file, so I haven't looked at it. Hopefully this is the right company...

So far as the train is concerned, I have no idea where exactly it is, and which way it's going, so can only speculate. However, there is a brake van between the loco and the train, so possibly a banking engine?

So far as the train on the viaduct is concerned, more speculation is all I can offer. The date, if correct, is before the compulsory use of continuous brakes, so that the train may lack these. There may be a guard's compartment in the rear coach, I can't really tell, but none of the others seem to have one, so has the operator borrowed a goods brake in order to have a handbrake at each end, possibly? Or even a handbrake at all, if I'm wrong about the rear coach?


Your identification of the Murphy wagon looks quite likely: thanks. The company did more than import ore, for which the wagon would not be appropriate.
The train is on the Eastern Valley down line so a banking engine would not be expected: if for adding braking I would have expected it to be in front.
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Re: queries on old photos

Postby andrewnummelin » Wed Nov 20, 2019 6:32 pm

Newport_rod wrote:The viaduct view looks like Pontsarn to me (see https://www.google.co.uk/url?sa=i&rct=j ... 8245272251) . And the GBV rather like the one in this view taken at Pontsticill,


Indeed, I'm sure you are right about it being Pontsarn.

The stock at Pontsticill looks very similar to those at Pontsarn, so most likely the Pontsarn train is a B&M one but with one coach from another line. I'd go along with Noel's suggestion about the use of the goods brake van.

I wonder if similar things may have been seen at Machen...
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